Baba
Respected Readers,
Namaskar. Below please find five letters related with this critical issue of MPD dogma. The first letter is from Dada Mokseshvaranandji who is conveying experience.
Following that are separate emails from brother Lalloo, Sukulji, Deveshji, and Kamalkrsnaji. All such emails are in reply to Mokseshvarananda's letter.
In Him,
Brahmadeva
AM Universal Moderators
Date: Fri, 25 Oct 2013 10:28:31 +0530
From: Markus Rosbach <mrosb....murt.net>
To: Ananda Marga News Bulletin 3
This is my first time to attend this function. No matter what function it depends on the people with what motivations they come which could apply to any retreat of Ananda Marga. The happyness and joy in this event and the highly charged spiritual energy is incomparable to any event I have participated so far. The Mahaprayan is just an occasion used to do kiirtan, we could use any occasion in my opinion, why not an initiative for Baba's birthday to do the same - just do it- that in October besides dipavalii there is no major Ananda Marga festival - it is as if Baba allocated this space for this function. Moreover during this period there is a major school holiday due to Durga puja and Diipavalii, so instead of focussing on all those dogmatic functions, we rather have now our own overshadowing all of these with kiirtan.Is kiirtan dogmatic ? I don't think so.
There are no speeches or discourses except Baba's recordings and workers RDS at the end.You make up your own mind - you want to be whatever you want to beno matter what the occasion.
BNK, Dada Mokseshvarananda
These following four letters are all in reply to Dadaji's above letter...
Subject: More Letters from Readers on MPD Dogma
Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2013 09:22:01 +0200
From: Amrit Lalloo <amrit.la.....com>
To: Ananda Marga News Bulletin
Namaskar Dada,
Good to hear from you.
"Appropriate to the solemnity of the occasion " is the message in in CV. and yet there is "happiness and joy" in this event. Are we celebrating or mourning? Confusing, ain't it ?
Kirtan is the food for us sadhakas and the longer the better. Kirtan is definitely not dogmatic, however, it being used to prop up the dogmatic mahaprayan initiative is distasteful. Much has been debated / discussed about the word and essence of mahaprayan (DEATH)- there is a bigger, broader picture. In the beginning there was some logic to the dreadful dowry system. Today one woman is being burnt alive every hour in India. Casteism also has its merits, however its demerits outweigh its merits. Baba was non-compromising on dowry, casteism, dogma and fissiparous tendencies.
Baba has spoken about a dog chewing on a dry bone which invariable cuts its gums. Thinking that the blood is from the bone the dog chews more vigorously- causing more bleeding. Time alone will reveal the dire negative consequences of man-made MPD Dogma.
We cannot create a new dogma to counteract any existing dogma (Durga puja). Baba has mandated many functions and festivals for us to enjoy the bliss of Kirtan. Why can't we (like you suggested) use one of these (Ananda Purnima) for a six day Kirtan?
Are we to believe that functions and festivals recommended by Baba himself is less important than MPD? Are we to blame Baba for the groupism in AM? NO! these are human misgivings guided by a bloated ego and greed.
At this point in time Ananda Marga is in crises and by surrendering ONLY TO HIS DIVINE PLAN will we be able to overcome.
In Baba.
Amrit
Subject: Re: More Letters from Readers on MPD Dogma
Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2013 10:13:30 +0530
From: tr sukul <trsukul......il.com>
To: Ananda Marga News Bulletin
Respected Dadaji,
Namaskar.
Dada Mokseshvarananda is partly right. To do kiirtan is not at all dogmatic but the term MPD is dogmatic which is used before the term kiirtan.
Rev Baba has given top priority to do kiirtan. He has encouragingly said to do kiirtan as and when we get free time for even one or two minutes . He often used to quote "Kiirtneeya sada hari". The full shloka is given below:-
"tranadapi suneechen tarorapi sahishnuta
Amanina mandeyam kiirtneeya sada hari"
This means, Hari kiirtan is not so easy, if you want to do Harikiirtan, you will have to have pain bearing mind like grass and trees and to pay respect to even those who do not deserve it. It is therefore said that one should always try to do kiirtan every time( means always try to acquire above said qualities as much as possible).
Rev Baba often used to repeat last three words of the above shloka .
So, why res. Dadaji is thinking that Kiirtan can only be done at the time of so called MPD? It will be better for him to do kiirtan as much as he can every time forgetting MPD.
Regards,
Dr T. R. Sukul
Subject: Re: More Letters from Readers on MPD Dogma
Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2013 19:22:42 +0530
From: Devesh Kumar <deveshkuma......l.com>
To: Ananda Marga News Bulletin
MORE LETTERS FROM READERS ON MPD DOGMA
Namaskar,
It looks very funny that many WTs / margis have not yet realized BABA. They easily fall prey to dogma in the name of Kirtan or other. For thousand years, priests, religious leaders have been exploiting society in the name of religion. If our WTs will support dogmatic functions in the name of Kirtan, then who will save our beloved Baba’s mission from such dogmas. Baba always reiterated “Dogma no more”, “Dogma no more”….
Kirtan is always better. No doubt at all. But do kiirtan to support His presence (Ananda Purnima, etc) - not to support that BABA has gone forever as it is the very meaning of “Mahaprayan” word.
In order to attract margis, huge memorial building was constructed with beautiful marble podium in the centre for the sake of making Tiljala a “Great Pilgrimage”. They wasted hard earned money in millions in order to make memorial building more attractive and to attract margis of the world. Baba Says,” While money has been spent lavishly for the construction of beautiful places of worship, money has never been arranged for food, clothing, housing, education and medical care for the welfare of the poor. While for four full years all the state revenues of Orissa were spent for the construction of the Konark temple, during that period not a penny was spent for human welfare. Needless to say, the history of all countries is replete with such examples." (Ráŕh: The Cradle of Civilization, Ra'r'h - 6)
Our Ananda Marga is a poor organisation - hardly we have even a single great school or college. Most margii children are studying outside AM schools. We should spend on schools; we should spend on PROUT and Samaj movements. We should spend to establish PROUT Government and Sadvipra Samaj so that suffering humanity will be relieved; that will be the right investment. And for multiday kiirtan, we can arrange kirtan in Pandals like we do in DMS.
If we try to attract margi brothers sisters based on the beauty of our memorial buildings then always those people will become more enamored with temples and places of worship like the Golden Temple, Ajmer Sharif, Macca, Madina, Jerusalem, etc. This is the way Dogma begins.
Here question arises- why we cannot arrange 5 days kiirtan on the occasion of “Ananda Purnima”? Ananda Purnima has been included in the list of festivals in Caryacarya by Parama Purusa, Mahasambhuti, but Mahaprayan has been created by human being (unit mind), not by Cosmic Mind and Mahasambhuti. Moreover, MPD is against Caryacarya as it is being solemnly observed beyond 12 days…
Baba says, "Human beings yield to this dogma with the sole intention of attaining selfish pleasures; even educated people knowingly submit to dogma. They know that they are surrendering their intellect to dogma, and that the outcome will be undesirable; they know and understand everything - why, even then, do they knowingly submit to it? They are all deliberate sinners and intentionally accept dogmas as truth. They observe that these dogmas are based on a´tma-sukha tattva...”
AT HIS FEET,
Devesh Kumar
Mumbai
Subject: Re: More Letters from Readers on MPD Dogma
Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2013 15:08:22
From:k.krsna <k_krsns....bhl.com>
To: Ananda Marga News Bulletin
Baba
MPD dogma is just like this type of lower devotion described in this following discourse.
"Today there is a particular festival, the floor will have to be besmeared with cow dung in this way, the Ganges water will have to be sprinkled, the idols will be decorated in royal fashion or in the fashion of a child, the mantras will be chanted, the flowers offered, the leaves of Aegle marmelos will be offered in this way and so on. Such devotions practised within the bounds of externalized usage and rituals is called Vaedhii Bhakti." (Subhasita Samgraha - 21, Bhaktitattva)
In the Tilajla MPD program they perform various external rituals (this after this after this) whereby on 26 October there is a great series of rituals to solemnise and commemorate this event like flag hosting, a short discourse from PP Dada / President, ashiirvacana, and other variuos rituals. All this is done around the holy tomb. In that way, people are invited from far-fledged places. Those who reach there do not realise that the Divine Supreme Entity is residing in their heart. So they came to Tiljala to offer homage at the holy tomb. That is why MPD is vaedhii bhakti, i.e lowermost devotion. Again please read Baba's above quote to refresh how vaedhii bhakti is done.
We should all pay heed to Baba's below warning.
"“In Ananda Marga, there is no place for vaedhii bhati." (APH-14)
In Him,
Kamal Krsna
All are welcome to write in with thoughts and reflections... - Eds
Respected Readers,
Namaskar. Below please find five letters related with this critical issue of MPD dogma. The first letter is from Dada Mokseshvaranandji who is conveying experience.
Following that are separate emails from brother Lalloo, Sukulji, Deveshji, and Kamalkrsnaji. All such emails are in reply to Mokseshvarananda's letter.
In Him,
Brahmadeva
AM Universal Moderators
Date: Fri, 25 Oct 2013 10:28:31 +0530
From: Markus Rosbach <mrosb....murt.net>
To: Ananda Marga News Bulletin 3
MORE LETTERS FROM READERS ON MPD DOGMA
This is my first time to attend this function. No matter what function it depends on the people with what motivations they come which could apply to any retreat of Ananda Marga. The happyness and joy in this event and the highly charged spiritual energy is incomparable to any event I have participated so far. The Mahaprayan is just an occasion used to do kiirtan, we could use any occasion in my opinion, why not an initiative for Baba's birthday to do the same - just do it- that in October besides dipavalii there is no major Ananda Marga festival - it is as if Baba allocated this space for this function. Moreover during this period there is a major school holiday due to Durga puja and Diipavalii, so instead of focussing on all those dogmatic functions, we rather have now our own overshadowing all of these with kiirtan.Is kiirtan dogmatic ? I don't think so.
There are no speeches or discourses except Baba's recordings and workers RDS at the end.You make up your own mind - you want to be whatever you want to beno matter what the occasion.
BNK, Dada Mokseshvarananda
These following four letters are all in reply to Dadaji's above letter...
Subject: More Letters from Readers on MPD Dogma
Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2013 09:22:01 +0200
From: Amrit Lalloo <amrit.la.....com>
To: Ananda Marga News Bulletin
MORE LETTERS FROM READERS ON MPD DOGMA
Namaskar Dada,
Good to hear from you.
"Appropriate to the solemnity of the occasion " is the message in in CV. and yet there is "happiness and joy" in this event. Are we celebrating or mourning? Confusing, ain't it ?
Kirtan is the food for us sadhakas and the longer the better. Kirtan is definitely not dogmatic, however, it being used to prop up the dogmatic mahaprayan initiative is distasteful. Much has been debated / discussed about the word and essence of mahaprayan (DEATH)- there is a bigger, broader picture. In the beginning there was some logic to the dreadful dowry system. Today one woman is being burnt alive every hour in India. Casteism also has its merits, however its demerits outweigh its merits. Baba was non-compromising on dowry, casteism, dogma and fissiparous tendencies.
Baba has spoken about a dog chewing on a dry bone which invariable cuts its gums. Thinking that the blood is from the bone the dog chews more vigorously- causing more bleeding. Time alone will reveal the dire negative consequences of man-made MPD Dogma.
We cannot create a new dogma to counteract any existing dogma (Durga puja). Baba has mandated many functions and festivals for us to enjoy the bliss of Kirtan. Why can't we (like you suggested) use one of these (Ananda Purnima) for a six day Kirtan?
Are we to believe that functions and festivals recommended by Baba himself is less important than MPD? Are we to blame Baba for the groupism in AM? NO! these are human misgivings guided by a bloated ego and greed.
At this point in time Ananda Marga is in crises and by surrendering ONLY TO HIS DIVINE PLAN will we be able to overcome.
In Baba.
Amrit
Subject: Re: More Letters from Readers on MPD Dogma
Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2013 10:13:30 +0530
From: tr sukul <trsukul......il.com>
To: Ananda Marga News Bulletin
MORE LETTERS FROM READERS ON MPD DOGMA
Respected Dadaji,
Namaskar.
Dada Mokseshvarananda is partly right. To do kiirtan is not at all dogmatic but the term MPD is dogmatic which is used before the term kiirtan.
Rev Baba has given top priority to do kiirtan. He has encouragingly said to do kiirtan as and when we get free time for even one or two minutes . He often used to quote "Kiirtneeya sada hari". The full shloka is given below:-
"tranadapi suneechen tarorapi sahishnuta
Amanina mandeyam kiirtneeya sada hari"
This means, Hari kiirtan is not so easy, if you want to do Harikiirtan, you will have to have pain bearing mind like grass and trees and to pay respect to even those who do not deserve it. It is therefore said that one should always try to do kiirtan every time( means always try to acquire above said qualities as much as possible).
Rev Baba often used to repeat last three words of the above shloka .
So, why res. Dadaji is thinking that Kiirtan can only be done at the time of so called MPD? It will be better for him to do kiirtan as much as he can every time forgetting MPD.
Regards,
Dr T. R. Sukul
Subject: Re: More Letters from Readers on MPD Dogma
Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2013 19:22:42 +0530
From: Devesh Kumar <deveshkuma......l.com>
To: Ananda Marga News Bulletin
MORE LETTERS FROM READERS ON MPD DOGMA
It looks very funny that many WTs / margis have not yet realized BABA. They easily fall prey to dogma in the name of Kirtan or other. For thousand years, priests, religious leaders have been exploiting society in the name of religion. If our WTs will support dogmatic functions in the name of Kirtan, then who will save our beloved Baba’s mission from such dogmas. Baba always reiterated “Dogma no more”, “Dogma no more”….
Kirtan is always better. No doubt at all. But do kiirtan to support His presence (Ananda Purnima, etc) - not to support that BABA has gone forever as it is the very meaning of “Mahaprayan” word.
In order to attract margis, huge memorial building was constructed with beautiful marble podium in the centre for the sake of making Tiljala a “Great Pilgrimage”. They wasted hard earned money in millions in order to make memorial building more attractive and to attract margis of the world. Baba Says,” While money has been spent lavishly for the construction of beautiful places of worship, money has never been arranged for food, clothing, housing, education and medical care for the welfare of the poor. While for four full years all the state revenues of Orissa were spent for the construction of the Konark temple, during that period not a penny was spent for human welfare. Needless to say, the history of all countries is replete with such examples." (Ráŕh: The Cradle of Civilization, Ra'r'h - 6)
Our Ananda Marga is a poor organisation - hardly we have even a single great school or college. Most margii children are studying outside AM schools. We should spend on schools; we should spend on PROUT and Samaj movements. We should spend to establish PROUT Government and Sadvipra Samaj so that suffering humanity will be relieved; that will be the right investment. And for multiday kiirtan, we can arrange kirtan in Pandals like we do in DMS.
If we try to attract margi brothers sisters based on the beauty of our memorial buildings then always those people will become more enamored with temples and places of worship like the Golden Temple, Ajmer Sharif, Macca, Madina, Jerusalem, etc. This is the way Dogma begins.
Here question arises- why we cannot arrange 5 days kiirtan on the occasion of “Ananda Purnima”? Ananda Purnima has been included in the list of festivals in Caryacarya by Parama Purusa, Mahasambhuti, but Mahaprayan has been created by human being (unit mind), not by Cosmic Mind and Mahasambhuti. Moreover, MPD is against Caryacarya as it is being solemnly observed beyond 12 days…
Baba says, "Human beings yield to this dogma with the sole intention of attaining selfish pleasures; even educated people knowingly submit to dogma. They know that they are surrendering their intellect to dogma, and that the outcome will be undesirable; they know and understand everything - why, even then, do they knowingly submit to it? They are all deliberate sinners and intentionally accept dogmas as truth. They observe that these dogmas are based on a´tma-sukha tattva...”
AT HIS FEET,
Devesh Kumar
Mumbai
Subject: Re: More Letters from Readers on MPD Dogma
Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2013 15:08:22
From:k.krsna <k_krsns....bhl.com>
To: Ananda Marga News Bulletin
Baba
MORE LETTERS FROM READERS ON MPD DOGMA
Namaskar, MPD dogma is just like this type of lower devotion described in this following discourse.
"Today there is a particular festival, the floor will have to be besmeared with cow dung in this way, the Ganges water will have to be sprinkled, the idols will be decorated in royal fashion or in the fashion of a child, the mantras will be chanted, the flowers offered, the leaves of Aegle marmelos will be offered in this way and so on. Such devotions practised within the bounds of externalized usage and rituals is called Vaedhii Bhakti." (Subhasita Samgraha - 21, Bhaktitattva)
In the Tilajla MPD program they perform various external rituals (this after this after this) whereby on 26 October there is a great series of rituals to solemnise and commemorate this event like flag hosting, a short discourse from PP Dada / President, ashiirvacana, and other variuos rituals. All this is done around the holy tomb. In that way, people are invited from far-fledged places. Those who reach there do not realise that the Divine Supreme Entity is residing in their heart. So they came to Tiljala to offer homage at the holy tomb. That is why MPD is vaedhii bhakti, i.e lowermost devotion. Again please read Baba's above quote to refresh how vaedhii bhakti is done.
We should all pay heed to Baba's below warning.
"“In Ananda Marga, there is no place for vaedhii bhati." (APH-14)
In Him,
Kamal Krsna
All are welcome to write in with thoughts and reflections... - Eds
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